Windows Vista?? have you been waiting?

[pandersen]

I installed Vista x64on my home PC after SP1 came out. I've never had a problem (once I turned off UAC ). Then again, I can't resist buying the latest and greatest hardware, which should obviously be more compatible than older hardware. I'd assume older hardware might have compatibility issues, but systems put together with fairly recent parts should have no problems. Aero is nice if your hardware can handle it, but somewhat unnecessary. I haven't noticed any slowdown due to the alleged 'bloat' of Vista. There may be some, but not enough to care about. In general I was very surprised how well it worked after all the horror stories I heard.

I like linux as an alternative, but since I'm a gamer freak I can't use it for everyday things. For hosting a website or email server it's my first choice, though.

As far as using Vista at work, not an option. RSLogix V17 may work, but I may have to support machines running anywhere from V12 to V16. Not to mention RSView and Factory Talk.

 

[surferb]

Tim,
After reading more into Vista specific development on Wikipedia, I'll split the difference with you. It turns out that they used more of the Windows 2003 Server code base than XP, which wasn't their original plan. They make changes under the hood that are a lot more than just massaging the GUI. They're all designed to be big performance enhancers, and most are, but some of at the expense of backward compatibility (intentional or otherwise). Network stack redesign, Kernel and memory managers, process and I/O schedulers, etc. At the same time they do what they can to improve backward compatibility emulation (this has been there under the hood at least since NT run DOS apps). Throw "security" in the mix - XP and MS had been taking a beating in this arena - and now we're talking about layers that prevent things from working and safeguards like only allowing digitally signed drivers (they have to run in privileged mode) and the User Account Control "feature" (UAC ) that ****ed everyone off.

Anyway, all that's complicated - with implications that even MS can't fully predict with legacy applications. My point was that they have a lot of really good development at the core. I think it's "higher level" parts and design decisions (how they prioritized compromises) that led to the pesky things about Vista that make it unpopular. It's all about how it "feels" to the user and the version of Vista home that came with my laptop last year made me want to throw it out the window.

But really, I think they have a good base to do things right. That $6 Billion wasn't entirely wasted - just a rework in light of their lessons learned. BTW, I'm told that Vista Enterprise will run well. I'm deploying it to about 100 computers, starting with 10 next week. I wouldn't have made that decision, but I'll let you know how it goes. My bigger problem is likely to be with Office 2007 and the nasty things between the seat and keyboard.

Your more up on computer technology than I am Nathan, but isn't the following referring to the abandonment of that foundation?


Or am I misunderstanding my original quoted text to say that they are not actally polishing up Vista and they are going back to the 2000/XP platform and massaging the GUI to be more like Vista?

 

[rootboy]

Have you (or anyone else for that matter) tried running any RSLogix/Linx products under a VM on your Ubuntu?

No, I use a company laptop for work, and I don't personally have the software. What I might do is to get our librarian to install it, try it out, and uninstall it just for fun.

 

[SonicClang]

no kidding Vista=ME. I've been mandated to upgrade > 100 computers at work to Vista/Office 2007 in the next couple of months. Oh gosh! Can you imagine?

I've been using Office 2007 for almost 2 years now. I absolutely love what they did with Access, but Word and Excel seriously need the menu bar back. They obviously still saw some merit in the menu bar because they kept it for some programs; Outlook and Visio. Most people associate the features they've been using for years by their name, not by picture. That's my biggest complaint about the ribbon. Let people use the ribbon who want to, but why take the menu bar away?

I feel for you. You're going to have >100 people complaining non stop to you once that "upgrade" is complete. And you better line up training sessions so you don't have 1,000 phone calls a day asking where "My Computer" went.

 

[RDS]

Bye Bye Vista

Check this link I recieved just today...
http://www.ien.com/ienblog.aspx?id=137745&ienUId=996820015

 

[GeoffC]

I've been using Office 2007 for almost 2 years now. I absolutely love what they did with Access, but Word and Excel seriously need the menu bar back. They obviously still saw some merit in the menu bar because they kept it for some programs; Outlook and Visio. Most people associate the features they've been using for years by their name, not by picture. That's my biggest complaint about the ribbon. Let people use the ribbon who want to, but why take the menu bar away

Try OpenOffice

 

[Operaghost]

Had to try it since it was mentioned earlier.

Ubuntu 8.10 host running a Windows XP guest via VMware Workstation. Online with a Logix5000 controller over an ethernet connection.

Easy setup. The guest doesn't know or care that the host is Windows or Linux.

OG

 

[ghettofreeryder]

OG, you copied my exact setup, Ubuntu 8.10 running VMware Workstation, XP guest

 

[Peter Nachtwey]

I have a MacPro at work

I use VMWare's fusion to make virtual machines on my MacPro. VMs are the way to go. I have a Win90, 2 WinXPs and one 64bit Ubuntu.
How do you beat that? One of the WinXP VMs is just for PLC programming.

My experiences with Vista were not good. I traded in my Dell with Vista for my MacPro and have never regretted the decision.

My MacPro has power to spare. I like the fact that OS X isn't corrupted with PLC software.

 

[Operaghost]

I really liked Vista but I made the mistake of buying the 32-bit edition. I like to give my VMs lots of RAM and two VMs at 1GB each was bringing my system to a crawl.

I ended up switching to W2K8 x64 Server. Now I am able to push past the 4GB limit. It is still essentially Vista without all the graphical bells and whistles. Unfortunately it is incompatible with my Windows Home Server.

I set up Ubuntu 8.10 (Intrepid Ibex) on a separate box just to try it out. It worked fine for me but I needed a machine with more RAM. For me the host machine is really unimportant as I do virtually all of my work in VMs. So if I can run Windows or Linux as the host it really doesn't matter much.

I am debating buying the x64 version of Vista here in the near future as my W2K8 is a trial with a 240 day limit and I am down to 50+ days! Perhaps I'll go with Linux at that time, but I doubt it. I really need the compatibility with WHS.

And I am too cheap to buy a Mac and my company won't spring for one.

OG

 

[ghettofreeryder]

Man i just ordered a Dell Precision 6400, oh boy Quad core, 8 gb ram, 64 bit Vista, 12+ hrs battery life..... oh ****, am I drooling.

As Opera said, the host os is quite negligible.

 

[BobB]

I changed to Vista on my laptop and home (work) machine after SP1. I must say it has been running very well for me until I got a rogue application on my main machine and have had to rebuild it.

The laptop is a Dell Vostro with 17" WUXGA screen - AWESOME!. I also have XP-Pro dual boot and Virtual Box for things that do not run on Vista - or things I have not bothered to try to get to run on Vista.

My main machine has a Dell 30" monitor attached to it - best thing I ever bought - runs at 2550 x 1600 - great for CAD and having 10 programs open at once - cutting/copying and pasting between them. Often Word, Excel, Citect SCADA, manipulating graphics, Omron CX-Programmer (PLC), Omron CX-Designer (screens - HMI) Outlook, MYOB accounting, Adobe Photoshop, Acrobat, CAD software (15-20 drawings open at once) and of course Solitaire. Vista does not miss a beat and one of the sidebar gadgets has always shows some RAM not used.

I thought about Vista 64 bit but my supplier advised that there would probably be compatability issues with LOTS of software so I bit my tongue and went 32 bit.

I did not go for a quad core until they get a lot cheaper and faster either. My motherboard is a Gigabyte X48 chipset and it is easy to throw a quad core in later.

My home machine is running mirror RAID as well. The funny thing is that the Vista Experience index shows the processor is the slowest part of the machine and it is the fastest duo core available. The fastest quad core available when I bought the machine was slower in fact - may have changed now.

UAC is an absolute pain but has been turned off on both machines - peace and quite.

It is also quite easy to install non digitally signed drivers - most of the drivers I have are not signed.

Vista is running much better for me than XP-Pro ever did by the way. Fortunately my favourite PLC manufacturer's software is ALL Vista compatible.

Office 2007 is certainly different and requires some 're-education' but it is fine once you are used to it. I did see a report that the next generation Microsoft OS will be very similar in appearnce as Office 2007. The guy who engineered the development of the 'ribbon' is on the Windows developemnt team to update the OS 'pretties' so do not be surprised at what happens.

The latest reports I have indicate that Server 2007 is an absolute rocket ship - some 10-15% faster than Vista. They may be doing something right in the background.

 

[ghettofreeryder]

Yeah UAC sucks. regrading the unsigned drivers thing, 32-bit Vista can run unsigned drivers, but 64 bit requires signed drivers i think. I have had more success with 64 bit Vista than i have with 32 bit vista.

Server 2008 is super fast and stable, but when i tried running it on my workstation, no burning programs would work, everything else was the same

 

[Operaghost]

I have Nero 7 on mine (W2K8) and it burns CD/DVD without issues. But I do most (but not all) of my burns through a VMware vm.

OG