Electrical enclosure mounted above a conveyor, against standards?

[CapinWinky]

I'm designing the controls for a new machine and when talking about were the cabinet was going to be, they showed me their current plan. Mounted 7 feet above the ground directly over the exit conveyor. I know I don't want to have to work in it that way, so I'm looking for language in a standard that forbids it.

OSHA 1910.303 has language about minimum working space and I'm trying to argue that space above a conveyor is not working space and they're not listening. Is there anything specifically about panels mounted high up and what can be under them?

 

[JohnCalderwood]

In the UK, Health and Safety at Work would cover you, or Electricity at Work.
Two main points -
7 feet in the air - if/when you work on it, will they provide a scaffold or a fixed platform? if not, then it is unsafe working.
Above a moving conveyor? Again, a safe means of access to prevent you falling onto moving machinery...

 

[rootboy]

I'm designing the controls for a new machine and when talking about were the cabinet was going to be, they showed me their current plan. Mounted 7 feet above the ground directly over the exit conveyor. I know I don't want to have to work in it that way, so I'm looking for language in a standard that forbids it.

OSHA 1910.303 has language about minimum working space and I'm trying to argue that space above a conveyor is not working space and they're not listening. Is there anything specifically about panels mounted high up and what can be under them?

Not that I'm aware of other than plain common sense.

There are rules about clearances, as you have mentioned, but I don't think that height is on the list.

 

[CapinWinky]

Yeah, I've been through NFPA 70/79, UL508/A, and various ISO stuff and the best I can do is language about the work space needing to be clear from the floor or platform through the height of the enclosure (which appears in numerous standards). I'm running with that. I'm expecting to be shot down with reasoning that a conveyor is a platform or that we can expect the customer to use a mobile platform.

 

[jraef]

There is an OSHA rule about clear access and not having to step on or stand over other machinery. I used it once on a situation where someone wanted a control panel mounted in a room above a number of pumps and pipes, where you would have to climb over the pumps and straddle the pipes to work on it. There was plenty of room in front of the door, which they argued met the clearance requirement, but I found the other rule about clear access, not clearance. I'll root around and see if I can find it again for you.

This might have been it, but I'll keep looking for the specific post I made in another forum at that time to be sure.

1910.303(g)(1)(i)(C)

The work space shall be clear and extend from the grade, floor, or platform to the height required by paragraph (g)(1)(vi) of this section. However, other equipment associated with the electrical installation and located above or below the electric equipment may extend not more than 153 mm (6 in.) beyond the front of the electric equipment.​

 

[blackandredwarrior]

Have a look at NEC 240.24(A) - 6'7" (to the center of the operator) if it has a disconnect that operates a circuit breaker or fused disconnect switch.

 

[Sherlock4me]

The code references you are looking for are in the National Electrical Code. Article 110, Requirements for Electrical Installation and a few others.

I have my 011 code book in front of me and it is possible some verbage may have changed, (slightly) since we have now an 014 NEC available; however, I say slightly because this is one of the more fundamental references in the code, and while it does happen, foundational and long standing references are tweaked with new code book updates less often than other references, but it would be wise to bring an 014 to if you need ammo.

110.26 Space about Electrical Equipment

110.26(A)(3) The work space SHALL BE, (powerful words as per 90.5(A)), CLEAR and extend from the ground, floor, or platform to a height of 6 and 1/2 feet or the height of the equipment whichever is greater.. etc..

There are 2 exception, none applying in your application.

If I understand your question, it sounds like there is a conveyor in your working space?

404.8 max height of switches and C.B.'s

And Yes absolutely blackandredwarrior 240.24(A) Accessibility

Also 110.26(E)(1) in this application

New to PLC's again and to this site but 20 years now as a Master Electrician. (Va. and Colorado)

A panel in the application you describe is against code and a clear safety hazard

Merry Christmas to all