Printing Out Ladder Logic Hard Copy

[panic mode]

we do custom equipment so everything is one of a kind, done per customers request and spec. we make three sets of documentations (as a package). one for us and two for customer (one goes inside cabinet and the other is archive i guess). each package includes printed copy of el. diagrams, pneumatic diagrams, any other instructions such as lubrication, troubleshooting manual etc. drawings are 11"x17", text file are 8.5"x11". plc program or hmi screens are NOT printed out (will do if customer asks and pays). last time i printed plc program out was five years ago. it was control logix program and printout was some 800 pages (just plc program, no tables etc.). each package also come with CD that contains folders with plc program, hmi program, pc programs in source code and executable, el. drawings in AutoCAD format (so they can make changes when machine ever needs upgrades, so far nobody did it them self, they always call us), pneumatic diagrams, bill of material, user manual, maintenance manual, electronic version of any parameter (such as laser scanner, nutrunner, devicenet, profibus, current EDS or GSD files) and any related manual that was used in project design (collection of PDF files such as motion controllers, ethernet cards, high speed counter cards, servo or vfd drives etc.). they get everything i would want if i had to repair or modify machine. this includes any datasheets, specs and even software if it's free (Movitools for SEW drives, Framework for DVT vision, ActiveSync etc.). the thing is that just because something is available for download, it doesn't mean that guy doing troubleshooting on a night shift or over weekend will have access to internet. this way they don't have to look for it when they really need it. we want the customer to keep track of documentation and programs. we keep records for three to five years. after that we might do cleanup of our archives.

 

[CaseyK]

1. Quit using LogicMaster
2. As mentioned print to pdf then adjust as needed if the software does not have the appropriate options.

When the multitude out there in the cornfields is using LogicMaster, you can't be sending them VersaPro or cimplicity or etc.

Most will not upgrade, and many can't afford to. Probably why they are not using Allen Bradley. As far as pdf's, I have yet to see anyone out in the prarie using them yet.

Maybe if we were closer to civilization...

Chicago is 90 miles, Rockford, Peoria, and Bloomington 60 miles, Bob's garage and beer frig EVEN closer!

This area had dozens of factories with 1000 to 2500 people employed. Now, if they are still even open, the workforce is less then 5%. I am surprised that they all went CAD, but then, they can get CAD guys for $6-8, while they were paying the board guys much more.

Perhaps it is a regional thing, but plc programs were printed out on a continuous form, and that is what most want. Most of these old time electricians probably understand ladder only becuase it resembles their old relay schematics.

Several plants have old continuous printers on their shop carts, along with the 386 printer.

DOS is a wonderful thing!

regards.....casey

 

[rsdoran]

We are in the 21st century

When the multitude out there in the cornfields is using LogicMaster, you can't be sending them VersaPro or cimplicity or etc.

I was basically joking BUT if YOU are looking for a method to create/print ladder files with more control then using VersaPro or Cimplicity, if you have , will allow you to use the LM file and create printed copies that should be the same. This would offer the ability to use print options, that allow you to control font, page breaks, paper size etc, and/or create pdfs that could be burned to cd/dvd if necessary. EVEN if the maintenance tech etc has to use an old 386 with LM does not mean the front office doesnt have fairly new computers that could be used for printing from a cd/dvd.

I have no idea what Cimplicity costs but I gave $700 for VersaPro which is not that bad overall so it is a viable option...in this case a new computer and software could easily be under $1500...with printer included (maybe). Most of the printers mentioned will start at $1500 or so to obtain the paper size you are asking about.

What is really neat is the ability to print on BOTH SIDES of the paper with newer printers.

Another problem is using some of the newer printers with DOS, the results may not be what you expect if at all possible.

I took the post as a means to find a viable solution to provide a service for the companies in your area. You can always use an old laptop etc with DOS and LM to program or get the file but use Windows based software for printing.

What you may want to do is talk with the GE people to determine what discount you can get for multiple copies (with licenses) of the software. Then look into pricing (discounted) for purchasing X amount of computers. If you can get it all together with good pricing you may be able to talk the companies into upgrading which technically they may need to do...in the process you might make a few dollars. Its a thought.

 

[Del Monte]

We have always used fan fold print outs. I think it is helpful to open up several pages to get an overall view. When we get print outs from the main office, they are printed on single sheets of an office printer, so we 3 hole punch them, and eventually get our big copy. We like to be able to look through the printed copy when we are online with the plc, rather then scroll up/down. We especially like this with our allen bradley machines. I do not like there software, but I am stuck with it until?

Del

 

[Mikey Wiliams]

I am happy to have any type of printout. Before I came north, we had handhelp programmers. Any logic document was hand wrote on paper towell from the restroom. We have several brands of equipment. I had over five years plc experiense before I switched my job and got to learn computers two years ago.

 

[BobB]

We have always used fan fold print outs.

Yep! When needed on a very large job, US fanflod is the only way to go. The trouble is the printers are really slow - have not seen a laser version yet.

The last time I used printouts was a power station job where I had almost 1500 pages of US fanfold. Up to 70 rungs spread out along the control room floor at a time!

 

[JesperMP]

It certainly never hurts to have a hardcopy of anything.

Customer typically gets 4 copies of all documents - sometimes more. Complete PLC program listing may take 3 full binders - sometimes more. That at least 12 binders in all.
To carry an updated set of documents in a suitcase has hurt my back a couple of times. Save the trees AND your back - use PDF.