Stuck Technology student!!

Happy Technology Student

WOW!!!
I have to say thanks to all the PLC gurus who helped shed a little light my way. Inevitably practice will help, and hopefully sort out my logic dyslexia. I am new to the world of PLCS and often get stuck on the concepts. I am however becoming passionate about the little electrical wonders (Thats pretty geeky huh?).
Thanx again yall!!
 
Ron:

You forgot the oneshot between the input and the internal.



What you did by accident is not a bad idea to do on purpose. We get this same problem almost monthly, and I've been searching for something better than "Well, what have you tried?" and "We won't do your homework for you, #&*@# !!!!"

I know what they've tried, and it isn't enough to post. A little of this, a bit of that, tweek this, and nothing seems to work.

I've been trying to figure out a way to lead them on a path to METHODICALLY solve this problem. But, except for using a Karanaugh map (which I guarentee they don't know and have no interest in learning (at this time), I haven't come up with a method.

But perhaps giving them a piece of DEFECTIVE code, and letting them troubleshoot it (and this thread is FULL of defective code, not just RSDoran's), might be one approach.

Plant a seed to get them started.
 
Allen,
I was reluctant to ask RS about his code because I thought maybe he wanted the original poster to figure it out. I thought I was going CRAZY over here. Anyways, can someone shed some light on mad's code. The B3:3 is a "Toggle Bit" or is it a "One Shot"? HELP ME!!!
Like I said I don't know AB bits.
Thanks
Tim
 
Y'all would come up with this when I am home and can not test

My code was taken from old tried and true GE Fanuc example code which doesnt have a one shot instruction that I know of or can locate in VersaPro.

I have used/tested it with AB SLC 500, and on a TI350 type (which was a GE also) but have only tested it on a Siemens S7 300/400 but found other ways to do it with Siemens.

I have posted this in the past and others stated it was similar to what they use, especially the toggle/flip flop aspect.

I will investigate because I did not intend to offer faulty code. I just know what its like to look at this PC screen when attempting to program something and the code just doesnt work right or is way too long (which in some cases has to be). I am not on the level of many here but I strive to be more than just adequate. As Terry has said "Good should never be good enough".

TIM
If you want to familiarize yourself with AB (which is very common here) than goto http://www.thelearningpit.com and get their LogixPro simulator program. Or you could download the SLC 500 instruction set from the AB site, it may help with the association.
 
Alright, I think I got it."maybe"
B3:3 is just a regular internal relay and the "Toggle" is just a comment that mad choose to use for a this bit. Sorry it just threw me off because the plcs I use have a toggle bit. Rs I'll take you up on that AB link.
Tim
 
RS
Thanks very much for redrawing the code I sent in. I will have to try your code as it appears there is several ways to do this. Isn't that always the way with code.I have to learn how to draw like you can. I am just an old guy and not very good on the pc stuff.
Mad
I have to try your code also as I couldn't figure this one out as I don't see how b3:3/3 is ever going to be true. But if it works that will be neat since it will cut out one rung.
IvyK
Good question as I have seen alot of people get stumped trying to use one momentary pb to start and stop something. So back to your orginal post.....its not as simple as it looks....and once it works it looks simple.
Thanks everyone
Johnp
 
Mad
I looked at your post 18!
That looks like it will work great. I can't wait to try it out.
Old dog thinks he learned a new trick!
Thanks
Johnp
 
Tim with AB you may have to register to access the online manuals. You goto Control Processors then SLC 500 and look for the Instruction Set.

The link is http://www.ab.com/manuals/cp/1747-rm001c-en-p.pdf

Hope it gets you there.

I just noticed that mad's post is the same as mine except the last one includes the one shot, I have never had to have it before. Must test.
 
Last edited:
Lookie what I found

Rs, I shuffled through some of my manuals and found PLC-5 Instruction Set Reference manual. Are the more common instructions listed in this manual going to reference well with the SLC 500 instructions?
Thanks for the info.
BTW, I wish I could get some experience with AB. It’s actually cost me some job openings because AB is such a widely used PLC in the US. Working for the Japanese though, you don't get many opportunities to work with AB plc's. That can really hurt you when looking for a job in the US. I can read manuals, but there's nothing like having a plc to put your knowledge into some sort of action.
Again, Thanks
Tim
 
Yes the plc5, slc500 and micrologix have many similarities, there are some instructions available in higher end models that arent in others.

A low cost solution to this is to purchase a Micrologix 1000 ($99 US) which offers a free version of RSLogix500. This should have all the instructions shown but not avaialble, actually you may be able to download that version of RSLogix regardless, will have to check. Another maybe cheaper option for the Micrologix 1000 is find it on ebay.com.

If you are versed in PLC programming then making a transition to AB shouldnt be difficult, mostly just familiarizing yourself with the Instruction Set. An employer shouldnt discriminate on the fact of not being familiar with a certain plc but should look at background of ability to program, of course at any interview you may have to convince people of capabilities. Never show doubt, programming is programming, if familiar with machines, inputs and output devices then "act" like you know what you are doing, even if you havent done it before.

I will give a simple example. I am not "great" in many areas like plc programming like some here. I wouldnt apply "great" to any of my skills. What I do is get the job done, quickly, efficiently, and find the information that is needed to explain it to superiors/customers. I was hired by a company approximately 1.5 years ago, at the time I didnt take the time to understand the pay raise/merit system they had in place, I hired in at top level (F9) for an hourly position. I was with the company for a year at the F9 level starting rate which I lived with but didnt like because I like the plant and the position I had. In that year period I did things no technician had ever done before, mainly it was knowing what to do to solve problems and state them(also willing to spend time/call ins ect). My skills with computers surpassed any tech before me (and many engineers). When the time came and with a little push by me I was given a double raise for my position and when June comes I expect to top out for my classification. I have made my place at this plant.

What all that diatribe means is that never admit you "can't", "can't never could". When talking to an employer never state you do not know AB but state that your strength is with Omron (an example) but have dealt with AB (one of those white lie things) and that the transition should be simple because of your overall knowledge of machines and programming. Emphasize/show abilities (my trick is to have a laptop with plc programming software which I take with me and attempt to show and tell with). Take the time to create a PowerPoint presentation on CD and/or create a website (the knowledge benefits from that can be astounding). The cost nowadays is minimal (maybe $10 yr for domain name and $60 yr for host), geez that is nothing compared to what I have paid in the past.

As you can tell I have a tendency to ramble, I apologize. Hopefully I stated something that may assist you in future endeavors.
 
Re: Y'all would come up with this when I am home and can not test

rsdoran said:
My code was taken from old tried and true GE Fanuc example code which doesnt have a one shot instruction that I know of or can locate in VersaPro.

Ron,

VersaPro has what they call a positive transition coil(Coil with a up arrow in it) and a negative transition coil(Coil with a down arrow in it). I call them OnShots and Offshots.

When the code in front of the Onshot becomes true the Coil is energized for one Scan. For the Offshot it is the opposite, when the the code in front of the coil becomes falls the coil is energized for one scan.

I found the AB OSR confusing when I started trying to use it because I was used to the GE Coils.
 
Sorry I was in a hurry last night when I posted my reply (#18).
Let me Explane.

OPERATION: PRESS THE "Input BUTTON I:1/0" and let go ONCE, AND THE "TOGGLE_BIT B3:3/2" comes on for One Scan
"Output O:3/0" COMES ON and latches.
PRESS THE "TOGGLE BUTTON Input" AGAIN, AND
THE "Toggle_Bit B3:3/2 Comes on for one scan and
"OUTPUT O:3/0" SHUTS OFF.
This Circuit is called a Flip-Flop. Rung 2 is the Flip-Flop and
Rung 1 is used for the De-Bounce of the Input.
 
mad said:
OPERATION: PRESS THE "Input BUTTON I:1/0" and let go ONCE, AND THE "TOGGLE_BIT B3:3/2" comes on for One Scan
"Output O:3/0" COMES ON and latches.
PRESS THE "TOGGLE BUTTON Input" AGAIN, AND
THE "Toggle_Bit B3:3/2 Comes on for one scan and
"OUTPUT O:3/0" SHUTS OFF.
This Circuit is called a Flip-Flop. Rung 2 is the Flip-Flop and
Rung 1 is used for the De-Bounce of the Input.

Excellent explanation Mad...

Not to be picky, but I'd like to make one clarification in your operating sequence so newbies won't get confused...

1.) PRESS THE "Input BUTTON I:1/0"
2.) "TOGGLE_BIT B3:3/2" comes on for One Scan
3.) "Output O:3/0" COMES ON and latches
4.) RELEASE THE "Input BUTTON I:1/0"
5.) PRESS THE "Input BUTTON I:1/0" AGAIN
6.) "TOGGLE_BIT B3:3/2" comes on for One Scan
7.) "OUTPUT O:3/0" SHUTS OFF (unlatches)

I mainly wanted to clarify that "Input BUTTON I:1/0" does NOT need to be released in order for "TOGGLE_BIT B3:3/2" to turn on for one scan.

beerchug

-Eric
 
Thanks Eric. Eric is explaning how the OSR Command works. This is for the newbies.

When the rung conditions preceding the OSR instruction go from
"false-to-true", the OSR instruction will be true for one scan. After one scan is complete, the OSR instruction becomes false, "even if the rung conditions preceding it remain true". The OSR instruction will only become true again if the rung conditions preceding it transition from false-to-true.
 

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