Will you work for peanuts

hey_rajan: Charities my arse. The US do not have a dept with you. Who do you thinck payed for th road you drive on? You could always go to Kashmir to stop the terrorist yourself.
Click to expand...

Oh Really ?? I didnt know that USA builds Roads from Social Security Contribution. I thought its from Taxes which we pay to IRS (15% Federal Tax + 8% State Tax in California).For your information our job is to earn foreign currency for India and we are doing it pretty good ! We Indian Engineers remitt $ 10 billion US Dollers to India anually.
And Yes we still treat Social Security as charity.

----'insect' reference removed by Phil---
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Wow, and I thought it was just me. I jumped into the network field only to watch the average pay go from great to you-gotta-be-kidding-me-I'm-not-working-for-that!. It doesn't matter how many certs you have now there always seems to be some kid willing to do the same job for half the money without realizing what this is doing to the market rates for experienced techs.

I'm back in industrial automation now, PLC programming, Robotics, Spot welding, Adhesive and Sealant applicators etc and make close to what I used to make as a net guy a few years ago before the market was flooded with kids.

The automotive manufacturing industry here in Alabama has really taken off. The OEM plants pay up to 30 bucks an hour. The suppliers where I work (for now) pay around 23 an hour tops. Mercedes is expanding their plant as is Honda and plan to hire another 200-300 maintenance techs. One problem, with all the industry coming to this part of the state, there seems to be a shortage of qualified techs, imagine that! Some places have opted to troll the local community colleges for trainees. Others are looking out of state and paying for relocation. Now is a good time to be an industrial tech in this area.

Hyundai is coming to Montgomery and will need a few hundred maintenance guys as well.

Heres the kicker, none of these plants are union....none. The UAW tried to get in and was run off. Now are you interested?

Before you jump, there's one more thing I forgot to mention. Most companies run 2 shifts. That's what I said, 2 shifts. I average 50 to 70 hours a week and have been doing it for 2 years now. Crazy? Maybe, maybe not, heres why I think not.

I don't pay anything for medical or dental bennies. We have 6 pct matching for our 401k's. The training in this department is great, I attend 5 or 6 schools on average a year. (Allen-Bradley, Kawasaki, Vision systems etc) I answer service calls in my assigned area and perform preventive work on the weekend. With approval from my supervisor I install modifications to the lines and edit programs as necessary. Engineering tells me what they want and I do it. No drawings, no prints, no parts list, I just make it happen. We mark up the drawings after the work is done. All the techs have a fully loaded laptop and just about every interface cable known to man. We have a training room set up with spare PLC's and drives to practice or 'work out' an idea. To sum it all up, one of the best jobs I've ever had.

I have no intention of working these hours forever, once my goals are met I will move on, it's what people do. Maybe I'll go to work for the post office and retire for a few years until I turn 60. (I used to work there as an ET, retired is the right word)

I'm just saying there are jobs out there but most of the time they are not within commuting distance. I still browse places like Monster.com and such and when I do find something that looks good you need to have 2 degrees and 20 certs just to make 20 bucks an hour. I think it's ridiculous but what can one person do?

Ok, I've said enough, for now. :D

If your interested in some of these jobs down here just do a search on alabama employment office or AIDT, you'll find most of the links there. Another place is AL.com and of course Monster.com. Good luck to you.
 
Last edited:
I earn ÂŁ26k (~$42,300 US) and have an all expenses (including Fuel) paid company car, which is essential for the job.

For this renumeration I have to work ave 60 hours a week with no overtime payment. (I work full weekends about 6 times a year - also with nothing extra to show for it)

My job involves just about every aspect of work in the machinery dept. including: designing(electrical, pnuematic & mechanical), building, programming, purchasing, installing, servicing, customer help/demonstrations etc.

I'm also regarded as the 'in-house' computer expert. However, this has more to do with the lack of expertise of everybody else in the company than my own computer skills (which I think are probably only average for my field).

I have a fair degree of autonomy and responsibily and for the most part I enjoy what I do. (Apart from the long hours)

The question is: Am I a mug and are my employers ripping me off?

Without wishing to blow my own trumpet, they'd be in pretty deep sh*t if I were to leave. Though I'm not sure that they realise this!

Anthony
 
Antipathy said:
The question is: Am I a mug and are my employers ripping me off?
Click to expand...

Supply and demand, supply and demand... Nothing has changed since the times of the venerable Adam Smith. Even Karl Marx could not change it...

:sick:
 
Thoughts.

Bob, there is a difference in the rates that get charged depending on whether you are working for yourself or for someone else. If you work for yourself then you have lots of expenses that an employee doesn't have.

Fritz_frederix. 48%! The serfs typically gave half, but they were serfs. Why do 'free' people enslave themselves so? In the end you are left with peanuts. Not good.

I think it is funny that an Indian is straightening out Canadians on how taxes go in the US.

I agree with Hey_rajan, social security is a charity. I will also back up his right to complain about it. There is no place in the U.S. Constitution that says social insurance is a function of the federal government. The 10th amendment says that since it isn't specifically listed as a function of the federal government, it must be left up to the states or the people. I just wanted back up Hey_rajan up with some good data. Hey_rajan, welcome to the United Welfare States of America!

Hey_rajan, what you may not be aware of is that the employer must also match your 7.5%. So in total it is about 15%. If you work for yourself you pay about 15%. If Bob is self-employed then he can tell us what this rate is. Isn't it wonderful what the government can do for(to) you?

Social security assumes that you will live long enough to take advantage of it, and hopes you don't.

Too many in this business work 12 hour days and let their health suffer for it. Their job is killing them and they don't see it until it is too late. The point here is the extra overtime may not be worth it. With luck life can be a marathon and not a sprint.

Those of you working 60 hours+ a week take care of yourself.

Another problem I see it there is a wide difference in knowledge level and general competency of PLC programmers and the managers are not competent enough to know who is good and who is not so everyone gets treated the same. This difference may not be logarithmic, but it can be very wide. It is much easier to see who is best in head to head competition like in sports.

The unions wouldn't like this though. I think unions do a lot to hold back the best of you.

There is no justice or eqaulity. You get what you are willing to put with if you are lucky.
 
I actually fall into a small small category of people who are over paid.

I am sure that some here will get peev'd at me.

I do however hate my job as a systems integrator.

The Money is good, but I am constantly asking myself if I should just quit my job and go back to school for another career.

It wasn't always this way. I made aprox .22/hr in the Navy (they never let me sleep, probably made even less than that).I made $5.00 an hour as a construction electrician in a non union shop. Then I took a job as a maintenance electrician in which they paid me $11/hr. Then I worked for a systems integration company and strictly programmed PLC5/40E's for aprox 15 - 20/hr for 5 years. I was constantly being told by my customers that they preferred me to work on their systems. I had the same billable rate as the other programmers, yet I was the only non-degree'd programmer. Even the secretary made more than I did. The average pay was 75,000.

I have seen complete morons with the right degree come in and make 6 figures.

I moved to California and finally got my degree in Electrical Engineering, and still didn't get paid. It wasn't until I gave my notice, right after landing a customer that my employer was trying to get for a long time, that I got my current wage.

A little finesse, a little luck, knowing the right people, and presto..... 40/hr. It shouldn't have to be that way. I am sure that there are plenty of people out there plenty more qualified than me, making a whole lot less. I try not to beat myself up to bad though, because there are way more people out there that don't have a clue making a whole lot more.

13 years in the industry and it still isn't routine. It has never gotten any easier. The more I know, the more questions I seem to have, the more pressures that get put on me.

I still consider myself green in the current industry in which I am working. No one seems to be able to answer my questions at work. Program after program that I have to review and make modifications to. Did I mention how much I hate my work?

Oh, and I doubt that I make $40/hr. If you add up all the hours I donate to my job, it is probably closer to 15/hr.
 
P.N " I think it is funny that an Indian is straightening out Canadians on how taxes go in the US."

Peter, we just don't have the same hunderstanding of what taxation really means.

There is absolutely no difference between being taxed 2 bucks at the amusement park and what you call "social security".

A higher autority DECIDES FOR YOU that YOU will SHARE some of your hard earn pesos with the rest of the comunity.

At the end of a given year, when a goverment has a deficit of billions of dollards, who cares where you sent your money. The left pocket cannot be full when the right pocket is in debt.

Of course you can have your opinions about if a certain taxe or the total of all the taxes you pay is justifyed. And you have all the rights to express these opinions. Its called voting day. Its called democraty.

Where I live we pay way to much taxes. Do you know of one man working anywhere which will tell you different.

Do you not make a good living.

On lighter the subject of peanuts:

I've been in this business for the last 20 years and have seldom seen hunderpayed people.

Of course, a lot seemed to be hunderpayed. They where so good at there professional level and where versatile, trustworthy, and basically good people.

Why then where they apaering like hunderpayed?

It is never all black or whyte, its many shades of grey.

For instance, one who would tell me about his feelinng of being hunderpayed. We discussed how he would make it so his pay would increase 50%.

This meant "CHANGE". This word scares many people. Change job. Change circle of work friends. Change location. Change job description. Change is scarry for many. They where feeling safe and secure in a job they have been doing for 10 years. Starting over is difficult for them.

See, and this is only one reason why some will accept a lesser pay. There are many more.

Someone like "hey_rajan" which travels the world to better his wages and possibly challenges is not affraid of changes. Can he hunderstand what this means. Maybee or not. But its a fact. Its there, its life, and it cannot be discarded when ones emit an opinion. If it is not taken into acount like manyer other factors, then its not an opinion, its more of a Barstool philosopher bla-bla.

Click here to get tips on how to increase your wages
 
Last edited:
I think that Pierre has stated the key problem. Most people do not like
change. Change creates too much of an uncertainty. Will I get another
job? Will it pay better? Will I like it? Do I have to move?
What we all seem to miss is that as technicians we deal with machines,
not people. The key word here is Marketing. To advance yourself you
must learn to sell yourself. This does not only mean knowing the
technical side of your job. You have to learn the language. Telling a
bean counter that controller will enhance a certain function in a
process will mean nothing to them. However, showing them where a
controller will save money and reduce operating expenses and they will
be on your side. Thus, you will not only be given the opportunity to
make use of your knowledge in an interesting way but you will also
bring to their attention that your ideas will save them money. This
will take time. In my current employment it has taken me ten years.
My job title referance is Electrical-Technician. I am licensed as an
construction-maintenance electrician. When I needed to know PLC's I
went and learned them on my own. The same for electronics, process
control, egronomics, etc. Now however, when the Managers or Engineers
recommend new equipment or major changes to our facility, our CEO will
consult with me as to the practicability of the project before he
approves it. Obviously, my pay has increased and yes this is an
unionized plant. Even within a union a person can still take their own
initiative and talk to the top people that run the organization.
It is now time for me to end the sermon and as I get down from my
soapbox I will leave you with a quote by A. S. Eddington that always
made sense to me. "We often think that when we have completed our
study of 'one' we know all about 'two', because 'two' is 'one and one'.
We forget that we have still to make a study of 'and'."
 
Back
Top Bottom