Head to Head Challenge - AdvancedHMI vs PeakHMI

Out of respect for the OP of another thread, I am starting this thread in order to stop further hi-jacking of the original thread. This is the original thread:

http://www.plctalk.net/qanda/showthread.php?t=103444

I will summarize the discussion that originated in the other tread:

- The OP asked for suggestions of HMI software
- I suggested AdvancedHMI and made the claim "is much easier to get started with than any other software on the market"
- My statement was challenged with a response "I beg to differ"
- To prove who's statement was most accurate, I offered a very simple challenge to be performed by both packages
- A more extensive counter challenge was proposed
- I gladly accepted

I am a firm believer that competition drives innovation and when 2 products compete, it pushes them to become better. The real winners are the end users by receiving better products.

With that point being made, I also believe it to be more beneficial when the end users direct the competition. Any time an advocate of a particular software makes the rules, it will most likely be biased toward their software of choice.

So what I would like to ask is for members not associated with either software package offer suggestions for the criteria of the challenge. Since the original discussion was which software is easiest to get started with, the criteria should be based around that theme. For the proof, a video is to be made showing how the various items are achieved. Therefore it should be 3-5 typical tasks that can done in no more than 10 minutes. We don't want to create long boring videos that no one will watch.

Also the criteria should be things you use the most in an HMI and you consider important. They can be things like a meter to display a value, a trend chart, a numeric display that changes color based on its value, etc.

So I ask for suggestions in creating an unbiased task list that will benchmark an HMI software.

IMHO

Why don't you just pay to advertise on this site and let the users decide what works best for them self's. It seems like all you are doing is using this site to push your product and use it for tech support for your site.

Hello,

I have already created a video using PeakHMI for the set requirements. The video is rendering as I type.

Folks can download the demo for PeakHMI and try it for whatever application they need.

This is not about competition. It is about your assertion and my disagreement. I do not consider "AdvancedHMI" competition.

When the video finishes rendering I will upload it to YouTube and post a link. The link: https://youtu.be/RTOo5ODLhN8

I did change one requirement. I do not have a 800 PLC with me, on the road, so I used a MODBUS TCP slave simulator.

bright676 said:

IMHO

Why don't you just pay to advertise on this site and let the users decide what works best for them self's. It seems like all you are doing is using this site to push your product and use it for tech support for your site.

Click to expand...

bright676,

FYI,
AdvancedHMI is free.

bright676 said:

IMHO

Why don't you just pay to advertise on this site and let the users decide what works best for them self's. It seems like all you are doing is using this site to push your product and use it for tech support for your site.

Click to expand...

I dont see what the big deal is. one software is free and the other is just a slight step up from free. I find it quite interesting and appreciate that these guys are willing to step up and show their products. so many manufacturers are fine with locking down their product and not allowing you to see or download a demo without giving your life story. The fact that these guys would put themselves out there in this competition shows that they are passionate about their product.

Mickey said:

bright676,

FYI,
AdvancedHMI is free.

Click to expand...

I feel that AdvancedHMI is moving into some grey area. While I appreciate the product go to the AdvancedHMI page and it is used as a means to generate business. You may not be purchasing the software but there is clearly a business that is developing here. More power to Archie for doing so, but there are more and more posts pushing AdvancedHMI.

PeakHMI is not free, and more often than not Mark's posts are are an attempt to push PeakHMI and generate sales. He uses the forum as free advertising. I fully agree with bright676.

Just move your eyes to the top of the page:

This board is for PLC Related Q&A ONLY. Please DON'T use it for advertising,etc.

Click to expand...

If any vendor becomes actively involved on the site, and pushes their product I think it's completely reasonable that they be asked to contriute to the site in the form of advertising. Probably opens up another discussion about Phil's intent for the site, and his stance on advertising.

Archie said:

So what I would like to ask is for members not associated with either software package offer suggestions for the criteria of the challenge. Since the original discussion was which software is easiest to get started with, the criteria should be based around that theme. For the proof, a video is to be made showing how the various items are achieved. Therefore it should be 3-5 typical tasks that can done in no more than 10 minutes. We don't want to create long boring videos that no one will watch.

Click to expand...

a huge part of my business is being able to turn up devices quickly. so I would be interested in seeing how quickly a list of tags with documentation, addresses, alarms, etc can be created. Im not real familiar with either package but I know I dont like sitting around manually configuring tags. so creating tags by script or csv is something that I do alot of with ignition. Ive created scripts that can run thru a list of tags in a csv file and create thousands of tags in minutes. its pretty awesome and saves tons of time.

So thats what I think would be a good indicator of ease of usability.

also putting data into a database table coupled with trending that data.

Mark- said:

Hello,

I have already created a video using PeakHMI for the set requirements. The video is rendering as I type.

Folks can download the demo for PeakHMI and try it for whatever application they need.

This is not about competition. It is about your assertion and my disagreement. I do not consider "AdvancedHMI" competition.

When the video finishes rendering I will upload it to YouTube and post a link. The link: https://youtu.be/RTOo5ODLhN8

I did change one requirement. I do not have a 800 PLC with me, on the road, so I used a MODBUS TCP slave simulator.

Click to expand...

Impressive. I had some questions. when you went to the brush configuration to change the background color of the value object, is it possible to bind to the actual setpoint value as opposed to typing it in or basing it on if the setpoint is in alarm? this seems like it would cause you to have to change the setpoints in that spot along with the actual setpoint values.

also, is it possible to make the values only log into the database on change? Seems like you would eat up alot of database space logging the same number repeatedly.

Hello,

Impressive.

Click to expand...

Thanks

when you went to the brush configuration to change the background color of the value object, is it possible to bind to the actual setpoint value as opposed to typing it in or basing it on if the setpoint is in alarm? this seems like it would cause you to have to change the setpoints in that spot along with the actual setpoint values.

Click to expand...

If you are referring to the brush color changing on the text value, the 10 steps are looking at the actual value to determine the text color. If more than 10 steps are needed, a graphic script would be used (not complicated). If you need a script example, let me know thorough our support email.

is it possible to make the values only log into the database on change? Seems like you would eat up alot of database space logging the same number repeatedly.

Click to expand...

Most folks use the ODBC logging for external trending, then other tools to examine the data, create reports, etc.. You can command the ODBC logger, via scripting, to only add a record on demand. We also have several other methods to get data into a database.

Mark- said:

I have already created a video using PeakHMI for the set requirements. The video is rendering as I type.

When the video finishes rendering I will upload it to YouTube and post a link. The link: https://youtu.be/RTOo5ODLhN8

Click to expand...

Well done and fast turn around. You held up your end, the ball is now in my court. Once I return to the office at the end of the week, I will produce my video and post it.

Just to throw my two cents into the mix - as someone who has not used either AdvancedHMI or PeakHMI, I personally don't see any problems with the way either Archie or Mark conduct themselves around here. I have never seen Archie disparage another brand, or even directly imply that AdvancedHMI is better than another solution - all I have ever seen is responses along the lines of "AdvancedHMI can do what you are trying to do, here's an example". This to me doesn't really stink of advertising - advice has been solicited by the OP, and relevant, practical advice is being offered. Advertising, in my mind at least, is an unsolicited promotion of your business and/or product to people who didn't ask for it, or to whom it is not actually relevant or helpful. A prime example of this would be a user who popped up for a little while ago named "ScadaDoctor", who proceeded to pop up on every SCADA related thread and post about how we shouldn't use SCADA software at all, we should go to his website and use Windows-based tools to develop custom HMI packages. After about a month, he was called on it, and he vanished.

Archie and Mark's participation in this forum I find on point and respectful. If I ever get the chance to propose and use either of their products, I am glad to know that they are around and that if I run into trouble, I have not only the wealth of experience this forum holds, but also the guys that design and sell the product.

Anyway, spiel over...play ball, gentlemen!

ASF said:

Archie and Mark's participation in this forum I find on point and respectful. If I ever get the chance to propose and use either of their products, I am glad to know that they are around and that if I run into trouble, I have not only the wealth of experience this forum holds, but also the guys that design and sell the product.

Click to expand...

I'm with ASF here. When someone starts a "what brand" thread, the whole thing is going to be free advertising anyway (or possibly free marketing, I'm never sure which). Archie and Mark are pretty up front about the fact that they are advertising for themselves, but they do it in a respectful and helpful way. There are a few distributor guys in here that do something simlar.

I wish we had Rockwell and Siemens developers in here providing the same kind of insight into their products.

Archie said:

So I ask for suggestions in creating an unbiased task list that will benchmark an HMI software.

Click to expand...

From your own suggestion in the other thread:

- Starting a completely new HMI project, create an HMI application that only has to display a single integer value from the PLC

Click to expand...

That is possibly a bit too simple.
I suggest:

Setup comms to the target PLC.
Setup variables linked to the target PLC.
Create a page with:

I think that to review ease of use, it makes a big difference if you are acquinted with the software in question, or you are a complete beginner.
I can certainly run through the above in a real hurry in WinCC Flexible and in WinCC v13, but is that a real test ?

edit: I think that even if the value of such a test by already trained programmers is limited, it is actually a good value to just see how other software is to work with.
Such a side-by-side comparison done in the same way on multiple platforms will be very interesting.
Much better than watching the original vendors own propaganda sales videos.

Archie said:

Since the original discussion was which software is easiest to get started with, the criteria should be based around that theme.

Click to expand...

wow. That's going to be tough.
If either s/w is looking to win, see Firejo....

But if you want to get value out of it, then you win no matter what; you'll learn how to make your HMI better.
Here's my vote:

"Easiest to get started" should include the install

• Windows 7 or 10? Home or Pro?
• Should be clean install, with only Windows updates allowed
• Install time should included everything after that
• Need PDF viewer or Office to see docs? include that time
• need some version of .Net? include that
• all s/w and dependencies included with install? or do I have to download separate? include that.
• must reboot PC? include that
• ... you get the idea

I would call that round one. Expert or amateur shouldn't make much difference in the time there.



Round two: the Jesper challenge

JesperMP said:

Setup comms to the target PLC.
Setup variables linked to the target PLC.
Create a page with:

An output field to display of one of the variables.
An input/output field to enter/view a value into one of the variables.
A button to set a specific value into one of the variables.
Some color animation of a display element based on the value of one of the variables.​

Click to expand...

Only 10 minutes? No chance a 1st time user could do that in ten minutes.