PLC 5/250 using 6200 software

[dweinhold]

I am working on a 5/250 system with 3 scanners. 1 is faulted and causes problems with the DH+ comms. The system works when I remove the faulted scanner. Where in the configuration is the assignment to the I/O racks for each scanner? When I try to download the backup, it says the scanner is missing. I have tried to remove it, but it tells me that it is referenced, so I tried to change the BTR's & BTW's to have the new association, but it tells me "INVALID BLOCK TRANSFER DATA ADDRESS".

Bottom line, I am trying to move the I/O that was on the 3rd scanner to the 2nd scanner. There is a list function similar to the PLC3, but is only available online. Is there a way to edit the I/O association on the offline file.

 

[daba]

This is going way back - probably 15 years since I worked on 5/250's, but I think I know your problem.

The BTD data-files used for Block Transfers are located in the I/O scanners themselves. Data-files in 5/250's have a leading number:-

0 = Resource Manager : eg. 0N7:0

1 = Logic Processor : eg. 1N7:0

2, 3, 4, 5 = I/O Scanners : eg. 2BTD0:0

Now if you move I/O using the LIST functions, then you have to edit the Block Transfer instructions and create new BTD files in the right scanner.

Hope this helps.

 

[dweinhold]

Thank you daba,

I am on the right track. I have a totally brain dead PLC. It was sitting without power for 3 years, so all of the batteries are dead. They have all been replaced and I am able to get online with it (no program in it) I do have the backup PLC program. So all of my work is offline.

It will not let me load the program because it says the 3rd scanner is missing. I have tried to change the address from 3BTD0:0 to 2BTD0:0 and that is when I get the fault message I described earlier.

I found that I could change the BTD address on the BTW or BTR to that scanner as long as that rack address was on that channel of the scanner.

I think I need to change the rack address assigned to the scanner. Do you know how to do that offline?

Once I have everything asigned to the 3rd scanner removed, I believe I can delete it and then download.

Again, thanks for your help.

 

[dweinhold]

I have been able to remove all of the BTD address in the file for scanner 3. There is 0 memory being used in the BTD for scanner 3.

It still will not allow me to delete it. It gives me an error that it is "referenced by other modules" Where can I find out what is accessing this card?

 

[daba]

If you have deleted all the BTD files, then the only thing left must be the scan-list.

I wasn't aware that you couldn't modify the scan-list offline, and my memory of this is too shaky to suggest otherwise.

A thought - is it possible to inhibit the scanner 3 racks in the I/O status area ? If it is, then it might allow a download with the scanner missing, although knowing A-B I'd bet you won't be able to.

I'll have a dig around see if I can come up with something.

PS. A new I/O scanner and some other spares
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Allen-Bradley-Pyramid-Integrator-Complete-4-Slot-Full_W0QQitemZ370052573267QQcmdZViewItemQQptZBI_Control_Systems_PLCs?hash=item5628da2853&_trksid=p3286.m63.l1177&_trkparms=240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50

 

[dweinhold]

Thank you very much daba,

This system is so old and this customer does not want to upgrade and I dont want to deal with it anymore. I am processing the link to ebay that you sent me. I was on ebay and searched for PLC 5/250 not Pyramid Integrator.

This case is closed.. Thanks for your help!!

 

[daba]

Just be careful with firmware revision numbers of replacement parts.

The 5/250 was/is fussy in some respects (mostly between Processors and Resource Managers), but there were a few issues with I/O scanners.

The link to eBay was a bit light-hearted, I never thought you'd go down that route !

daba

 

[dweinhold]

Thanks for the heads up.

The 5150-RS A in the picture on ebay is the same as the one that is not working. I checked all of the firmware rev levels, they are the same as what I have here. I should be in good shape.

 

[jimbo3123]

I'm sure that you customer doesn't want to upgrade, but looking at $2k fix for an ancient system might be the incentive that they need to put in a new system.

I would certainly push them that way.
After all, other components will certainly fail sooner or later and I'm sure that they don't want to keep spending big bucks for old used ebay parts (or worse, come to a point where no spare parts are available). Not to mention software issues with running 6200 on a modern OS, etc.

 

[dweinhold]

I agree 100% jimbo3123, but my customer is a machine rebuilder and they prefere a cheap fix. (in fact the cheaper the better). And about 6200, I am running it on a old PC with Win98 (at least I can still boot to DOS). I cannot get the USB com port to work reliably on my XP machine though the KF2. You are right about that too.

The end user of this printing press will suffer the loss when the system fails and parts are no longer available. There is nothing I can do about it.

 

[dweinhold]

The system is up and running using the parts from ebay.

On a side note, I found out how the I/O is assigned and why I could not delete the 3rd card from the program. The rack numbers are fix grouped to the scanner based on the thumbwheel.

Thumb Wheel Setting:

1 = racks 0-7
2 = racks 10-17
3 = racks 20-27

So, any I/O in the program that was referencing racks 20-27 was causing me not to be able to delete it

I did not catch that at first. Dont know who to thank at AB for that one.

 

[daba]

My apologies for not mentioning the rack assignments problem you have found the answer to. I had assumed that you had this sussed, since you knew you had to change the BTD/BTW file addresses, then you must have known that any references to I/O in racks 20-27 would need to be changed also - my bad.

But then again, you were attempting to re-adress the I/O into a different scanner, so surely you would have edited all the I/O associated with the move of the racks ? That would have removed the scanner 3 assignments and should have allowed you to delete it.

But I'm glad you got it up and running again - good old eBay !

 

[dweinhold]

Thanks daba,

I have worked on many PLC 3 and 5's. They have no restrictions on where you put racks. The PLC3 does not care where the rack are places on any channel of S4B or S5 cards.