OT -Love(???) For Industrial Engineers

[James Mcquade]

Everyone at UT Martin laughed when I went to work in industrial maintenance.
Said I was nuts. I told them that in 10 years companies would want engineers who wasn't afraid to get greasy, work on the line, do wiring, and so on.

I was right.
I went to work for an OEM as an electrician, panel builder, panel designer, programmer, purchasing manager, inventory clerk, quote manager, write documents, commission machinery, mechanical designer, you name it.

I don't build volkswagons, I build Sherman tanks.
not the fastest, smartest, I ask what if questions, goto maintenance for help, and I know when i'm over my head and ask for help.

I understand the original post! we hired a so called industrial engineer who did a nice sales job and got hired. Couldn't find his way out of a paper bag.
to this day, if I hear his name being mentioned for a job, I protest.
Yes there are engineers like that, and there are those newly graduated ones as well as those in the field for a couple of years who want to learn IF we help them along their journey and teach them the ropes.

My apologies if I offend anyone in advance.
James

 

[kwade]

See this is one of the things that scares me about our industry. The guys I've met who actually develop products (especially software engineers) have never used their type of products out in the field, and almost never interact with real users. They typically take a spec that someone else has written, and design a product that meets it. Usually without questioning if the spec makes sense.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNuu9CpdjIo

 

[Chris Taylor]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hNuu9CpdjIo

I fully understand some people's frustrations because there are plenty of "Copy & Paste Consultants" out there. I come across them often and it's somewhat scary when the guy who designed a bit of plant can't even identify the components in real life when standing in front of them.

My customers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg

 

[DwSoFt]

Yes there are engineers like that, and there are those newly graduated ones as well as those in the field for a couple of years who want to learn IF we help them along their journey and teach them the ropes.

I agree there are some that want to learn, maybe not a majority, but there are some. and there are some really good ones out there.

Think of it this way, poor work, wether it be the engineer, the electrician, the painter, the plumber, etc. will always keep the good ones busy. sad but true.

 

[nehpets]

The term "Engineer" is the most overly misused word in the English language, for instance - Janitor (sanitation engineer), housewife (domestic engineer) etc, etc.
An engineer is a man walking up a railway line with an oily rag hanging out of his back pocket.

Steve

 

[Aabeck]

On a side note, I was once talking to a manager of an engineering department for a large corporation (mostly mechanical engineers that made things) and asked her how long she had been an engineer. She emphatically responded she was not an engineer, but a manager of them.

I asked her how she could manage engineers without knowing how to do it herself. No answer to that question.

And I agree with Steve - every time someone says engineer to me (without the industrial, mechanical, electrical, or other) my mind pictures a large black steam engine pulsating down the tracks. Oh the good ole days.

 

[kwade]

my customers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkorp55aqvg

+1

 

[RET]

That's kind of funny, especially coming from a guy who has probably done the same job for 20 years.

 

[trentg@felixconstruc]

I am having a hard time understanding why so many engineers are needed for everyday maintenance. Most factories I have worked for/at have maintenance staff for existing processes and engineers for product and new ventures. The few modifications that are made to processes that are punching out money are not done in during the middle of a run or Friday evenings, because leads don't want money (production) to dip.

When I was a technician the "engineer working the floor mentality" was explained this way: Regardless of how dirty your parking lot is and regardless of who is coming to visit would you put your engineers on a broom to sweep. They should be better educated than your janitor, more drive, more efficient and hella broomers, but why pay that wage to do something that someone else was hired to do at a fraction of the rate. No matter how you slice it, it is a lot more expensive for me to wire a panel verses the panel shop crew. If they can't do the job, you have the wrong crew. If your engineers are building panels, changing proxes, setting parameters or troubleshooting I would like the opportunity to detail the advantages of hiring a company like the one I work for to help save you money. We are a full service shop that will provide a WORKING and TESTED processes that requires minimal support (most certainly not a degreed engineer).

 

[Peter Nachtwey]

Just had another run-in with a highly trained industrial engineer. I actually asked his boss in front of him if engineers had a college course on how to ask others to do their job for them as they couldn't.

It took some simple editing, but I "found" the following class in an engineering bachelors degree program:

The image says
"Engineers may held...." what about writing proper English? I would not trust that school. The spelling check said it was OK is similar to saying my code compiles so it must run.

 

[Iner]

My customers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BKorP55Aqvg

That's gold.

Especially the manager saying "Why it is impossible, just ignore it"

 

[Tom Jenkins]

If your engineers are building panels, changing proxes, setting parameters or troubleshooting I would like the opportunity to detail the advantages of hiring a company like the one I work for to help save you money. We are a full service shop that will provide a WORKING and TESTED processes that requires minimal support (most certainly not a degreed engineer).

I was paying these engineers to do these jobs out of my own pocket. When I started I did all of these things myself, and as years went by and I hired more help I kept the same system for all the guys. I found the following advantages:

- It made them better engineers. They designed things that could be built and installed more efficiently.

- They understood customer needs. Being eye ball to eye ball with customers and contractors taught them what was really important, not what some ivory tower academic thought was important.

- They had respect on the job site. The owner and contractor developed confidence in them, so when they said something had to change or they needed help it happened. Partly because they had degrees, but mostly because they demonstrated competence. In return they learned to respect the talents of tradesmen and operators.

- They were more efficient in commissioning and trouble shooting. Because they understood the theoretical aspects and the relationships between very complex processes they were more likely to get it right the first time.

When I sold my business to a large corporation we did joint start ups with their group, which used the conventional engineer in the office and technician on site approach. My guys could get it done in one trip, often helping with the tech's job as well as their own. On big jobs, with staged commissioning, we almost always got the request on the second trip to send my guys, and don't bother with those other fellows.

 

[trentg@felixconstruc]

Tom,

I can see where a structure like your can be very beneficial to a sole proprietor with a small to medium sized business. I have worked for a 5 person integrator where we were all Controls Engineers and/or Electrical Engineers and it was great for all the reasons you listed. Plus I learned something new every project. However, that is very different from a 24/7 factory trying to shave a penny to compete in a particular market. I worked for a nutraceutical where the profit margin was less than a penny per item, a long power outage could kill a months goals, much less adding thousands in salary per year. I would have a hard time convincing them to replace the role players with well rounded engineers.

Even more impressive to me is the fact that you found a full staff of engineers that were willing to do field work and could get along with one another! Got to pay a guy a lot of money here for that combo!

 

[Mark Snodgrass]

And I agree with Steve - every time someone says engineer to me (without the industrial, mechanical, electrical, or other) my mind pictures a large black steam engine pulsating down the tracks. Oh the good ole days.

I on the other hand, picture mid medieval catapults and trebuchets .

Per Wikipedia:

The term engineering itself has a much more recent etymology, deriving from the word engineer, which itself dates back to 1325, when an engine’er (literally, one who operates an engine) originally referred to "a constructor of military engines."In this context, now obsolete, an "engine" referred to a military machine, i. e., a mechanical contraption used in war (for example, a catapult). The word "engine" itself is of even older origin, ultimately deriving from the Latin ingenium (c. 1250), meaning "innate quality, especially mental power, hence a clever invention."

 

[Aabeck]

I on the other hand, picture mid medieval catapults and trebuchets .

Either I'm not that old or my memories of back then have left my consciousness. But I do remember steam engines, and like seeing them restored and ran for trips.